(hammer?)/shotgun dps. Dot stacking offhand.

Discussion in 'Damage Dealer' started by Claire-V, Jul 24, 2017.

  1. Claire-V

    Claire-V New Bee

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    Hello,

    Here is the build I'm currently using as Mdps. It uses the good dps of Hammer as a main hand (but it works with any weapon that allows 2 free slots for the secondary) and the shotgun as a powerful offhand.

    The idea behind shotgun offhand is to take the "full" damage potential of the weapon's gimmick with dragon's breath with a little bit of micro management on the DoT. Unlike other weapon's gimmick with damages that scale with their usage.

    Since shotgun is a tank weapon, there is no 3 ressources consumer (except if you want an AoE) to easily stack the dots. The consumer I have to pick to achieve it is "raging shot". Making it difficult to use the consumer every 5 second to refresh and stack the dot.

    To manage it, we use Shell Salvage (+ the passive to guarantee orange shells) and a timed usage of raging shot (refreshing the dot when the timer is low).

    To track the dot, I recommend using the mod "effects UI" with the new "tracking" feature using:
    Dragon's Breath | show:**@caster (remove the **, i dont' see where i can remove the automatic smiley faces)

    It looks like in SWL only a limited instances of the same debuff can be displayed at the same time (even if more are active in the background). So you can't always see your dot if other players are using it too but it's still enough to manage it.

    Here is the concept of the rotation used to slowly refresh the dot upwards
    [​IMG]

    It doesn't include any additional energy source, without them you can occasionaly dip under 6 stacks.

    Here is the build:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Weapons and affixes:

    Hammer: Pneumatic maul of Havoc
    Shotgun: SPES-C221 of Alacrity

    Notes:

    Combat reload is used to provide extra shells and increase the value of shell salvage, it allows more mistakes in the rotation and helps swapping targets or recovering from a downtime.
    Moreover, it synergises well with the SPES (explained here by Szalord).

    Shell salvage or getting a shell reload doesn't trigger a GCD but the ability swap animation has a kind of cooldown that seems to be inferior to 1s that only locks the swapping abilities out so using your main weapon during this lockout is recomended.

    Here is the damage contribution from the main dps sources without hammer signets, pneumatic maul or spes.

    You can see it in action in E8+ dungeons on this stream: Twitch
     
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2017
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  2. Onevia

    Onevia Conspirator

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    Is the 1 second for SS treating it as instant + a second to reload? When I tried parsing with shotgun it took me longer than 1s combined, I think cause hitting 0 shells causes a short cooldown before you can reload (ie. SS, hammer, then reload was quicker than SS, reload, hammer)

    I think Fast & Furious would also be better than White Phosphorus, since it's buffing your main damage dealer and elite. But it's a matter of 2% vs 3% not make or break. Seethe's passive seemed nice for bursty damage to me.

    Are you using Combat Reload's refill to tell you when to fire or they just happen to sync up when you do the rotation?
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2017
  3. Claire-V

    Claire-V New Bee

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    I think it's 1s + 0.5s, I didn't want to put half seconds there but you're right it is more than 1s.

    It is probably better than white phosphorus but I use this passive only for fights where I can't always stay in melee or where I have to AoE. I think seethe's passive brings similar damage but it has more utility (rage on demand) than fast & furious.

    I use it to have a high sell count for shell salvage so it gives me more ressources. For some bosses (where you need to swap) it helps restacking faster.
     
  4. Tsuko

    Tsuko New Bee Dragon

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    IGN:
    Tsuko
    Smart build :) thx for sharing !
     
  5. Claire-V

    Claire-V New Bee

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    About combat reload, the passive can interfer with shell reloading (/shell salvage). If you run out of shells right before the proc of shell salvage, it will give you a single new shell and waste the "gcd like" shell swap lockout. To avoid that, it's better to use shell salvage early after a combat reload proc so the whole reloading process is executed before the next combat reload tic.
     
  6. Pleya

    Pleya New Bee Dragon

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    Time to "craft" a new shotgun i guess.... Which shotgun is the best dps wise?
     
  7. Szalord

    Szalord Agent

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    From our tests, it looks like the SPES-C221 is the best. Its proc is a bit ridiculous, gives 2 to 4% of my overall damage while my shotgun is lvl 30 purple, and the main hammer is 35 mythic... But hold on, i'll try to parse a bit and have a closer look on how it actually works. Because as it goes, i've been under impression that it procs more than just the 20% described, maybe that comes from "spending shells" with Shell Salvage. If i'm wrong about that, than Plasma-Forged should be the best.
     
  8. itzik25

    itzik25 New Bee Dragon

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    lol combat reload really?
     
  9. Szalord

    Szalord Agent

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    What's the problem?
     
  10. Pleya

    Pleya New Bee Dragon

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    I think it's because of the benefits of having more shells while using shell salvage?

    How do they compare atm? The cache power creep is real xD
     
  11. itzik25

    itzik25 New Bee Dragon

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    its like throwing a passive slot to the trash.
     
  12. Pleya

    Pleya New Bee Dragon

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  13. Szalord

    Szalord Agent

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    You clearly haven't tested nor thought a little bit about it. Its purpose is to grant you more energy every 20s (up to 4 energy every 20s), which allows you to ramp stacks a LOT faster (and get more damage from Raging Shots). It used to be mandatory back when you had low crit, it's still is for the following reason. Ramping stacks faster is a big deal, very big.

    I discovered that Shell Salvage synergises with the SPES-C221 weapon : all the shells spent by Shell Salvage have 20% chance to proc the SPES. Moreover, it appears that the SPES can store the procs for up to 6 times (you can track the invisible debuff with EffectsUI), and the procs remain stored even after combat. This is why the SPES procs are so huge in my parses, and this is why Combat Reload will gain even more value here. Basically, Shell Salvaging 6 shells gives 6 chances to proc the SPES and store it, each shell spent has 20% to proc, as stated. Without combat reload, We'll be salvaging 2 shells only.

    Considering this, the Plasma Forged shotgun has NO WAY to catch up in damage for shotgun secondary, compared to SPES-C221.
     
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  14. ziboo

    ziboo Conspirator

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    Everyone has an opinion, but it might be better if you actually offered a solution instead of just give a snarky response. There's a better passive then state it.
     
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  15. itzik25

    itzik25 New Bee Dragon

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  16. itzik25

    itzik25 New Bee Dragon

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    i did.... the fire shell passive is defenetely better option.
     
  17. Claire-V

    Claire-V New Bee

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    The fire shell is 12% more damage for the ~15% of your dps that is dragon's breath. So ~1.8% (and it will decrease as the main hand scales better with gear, especially hammer) if your dot uptime is perfect, at this point even fast&furious may be better.
    Combat reload offers much more flexibility (especially for target swaps but can also be exploited to recover from mistakes), gives more shotgun ressources on shell salvage and as Szalord found out, synergises extremely well with the SPES-221.


    So even if you ignore the extra ressource's damage and the flexibility, the SPES-combat reload alone should be on par with phosphorous.
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2017
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  18. itzik25

    itzik25 New Bee Dragon

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    alright... i might have under rated it.
     
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  19. Darkstride

    Darkstride New Bee

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    IGN:
    Darkstride
    You might try using a build or passive before calling it trash and trying to "educate" others on what works. Your statement sounds ignorant and rude, mostly because you are wrong. That's not a constructive contrtibution.
     
  20. Szalord

    Szalord Agent

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    Breathe a bit friend, he understood and retracted himself :).